Talk:Mike Love

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Nuclear disaster

Re my most recent edit, see http://www.thesmileshop.net/essays_reum3.html . This was written by Peter Reum, one of the most well-known authorities on the Beach Boys (cited, for example, in the liner notes for the CD reissues of the band's albums, and often credited as a researcher on documentaries, etc). He clearly states: "Brian got a form of emotional release and humor from seeing conflict. He scripted a scene at a rehearsal for Heroes and Villains at the 1967 Hawaiian Live Concerts in which Mike Love actually reads a Brian authored script making fun of Brian for having a less successful sales result with the Heroes and Villains single than anticipated. Brian is making fun of Mike making fun of Brian and Van Dyke's art during Smile's recording several months beforehand. Self-deprecation is a major form of expression of what Brian finds funny. " Given that Wilson can be heard on the tape encouraging Love, and without any actual evidence to the contrary (and no, statements by Domenic Priore do not count until he learns the difference between his own unsupported opinion and actual fact), this comedy monologue should *not* be used as an example of Love's dislike for Smile. Love's problems with the album, in fact, do not include Heroes & Villains, and he has often noted that he considers that track Brian's last great work (see, for example, his interviews in the Endless Harmony documentary) even though he dislikes the rest of the album (especially the lyrics to CabinEssence). Stealth Munchkin 14:36, 14 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

first cousin

If Mike Love is first cousin to the Wilsons, his mother must be a Wilson. What was her name? For that matter, what are Mike Love's parents' names? - Nunh-huh 20:48, 19 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Mike Love's parents are Milton Love and Emily Wilson (sister of Murry Wilson) - Little Surfer Girl xxxx

True about his parents being Love/Wilson. But not necessarily true that his parents must be Wilsons. For instance, if Wilson's mother was named "love"-which of course is not the case. I'm bring this up to show the fallacy in the assumption.J. M. 01:37, 17 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Made the stuff about the Fall song more encyclopaedic. Catachresis 01:16, 21 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Electro-Theremin

In early footage of the Beach Boys, you can see Love playing the Electro-Theremin (aka "Tannerin") for "Good Vibrations". They put little dots on it so he could see where to move the slide-bar-thingie. He's also bitching about it on the live recording of Good Vibrations included on the Good Vibrations box set ("They want me to play this wah-wah thing!"), from 1966. My edit was reverted saying it was a small Moog synthesizer. Maybe that was the case later on, but not in 1966, when hardly anyone knew who Moog was and his synthesizer was the size of a small garage. The Beach Boys borrowed the Electro-Theremin from Tanner and took it on tour.—Chowbok ☠ 20:37, 2 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I won't change it back, but I am not completely wrong. This is from Theremin:

Contrary to popular belief, the theremin was not used on the 1966 recording of "Good Vibrations" by The Beach Boys, which featured Paul Tanner's "box", later called the electro-theremin. However, for concert appearances, an oscillator slide-controller was designed and built for Wilson by Robert Moog.

So Moog was involved in some way, and in my memory, the little woo-woo machine in the early footage was clearly a keyboard, but I was wrong. Sorry! MookieZ (talk) 21:05, 2 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Or read the third Q&A here: [1]. I don't know whether this thing would count as an electro-theremin or a synth or both or what, but it's not the Tannerin. MookieZ (talk) 21:21, 2 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Importance Ranking

Rated importance as 'Top', Mike Love is lead vocalist with the Beach Boys, a Rock and Roll Hall of Fame member, also rated the article grade as a "Start" for the WPBiography project. Additionally, a grade of 'B' (as it currently is ranked in the WPRock box) is two classes too high for a totally unreferenced article. According to the WikiProject article grading scheme, this article cannot be any higher than a 'Start'. Jusdafax (talk) 20:26, 25 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

UPDATE: Over six months later I don't see much real improvement here, especially in the references. This is not a 'B'-class article, and I'm demoting it to a 'C' for WPRock, which it barely deserves as it has only 3 references. Whatever one thinks of Mike Love, his Wikipedia article needs and deserves work. Jusdafax (talk) 18:30, 13 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Lack of sources

This article makes many assertions that shouldn't be here without sources. The article has been tagged for sources since 2006! I'd regret cutting it down to a stub, but this much unsourced material should not be kept in an article that mentions so many living people. Will Beback talk 00:25, 19 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I'm going to start cutting out a lot of the unsourced claims very soon, unless someone starts adding sources. Santa Claus of the Future (talk) 18:16, 5 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Legal controversies

I have seriously cut back this section as we have no refs. Please only restore the text if you references. Thanks. --BwB (talk) 00:31, 8 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Just parking the removed text here for reference.

"In the late 1990s, Brian Wilson went to court to regain his rights to the publishing company Sea of Tunes, which owned the copyrights to most of the Beach Boys' hit songs. The suit stemmed from Wilson's pressured agreement to sign over his publishing rights to his father Murry Wilson in 1969. The court judgement found that the contract Wilson had signed was invalid, due to his mental state at the time of signature. (It was also suggested that Murry may have signed his son's name on the original rights document.) Wilson failed to regain his copyrights, but won a $25 million settlement.

Incorrect - the settlement was $10 million. 86.8.131.225 (talk) 21:04, 12 March 2016 (UTC)[reply]

"Following Wilson's win, Love launched his own lawsuit, asserting he had made significant writing contributions to many Beach Boys' songs, including two titles on Pet Sounds',' and that he had never received due credit, or the accompanying royalties. Love won the case, aided by Brian's statement that Mike's assertions were correct. Tony Asher has unequivocally stated that Love had no input into at least one song involved, "Wouldn't It Be Nice" - though both Wilson and Love attest that Mike Love wrote the "Good night, sleep tight" coda of the song. As a result of Love's action against the Sea of Tunes agreement, he was granted $13 million of Wilson's award, and his name was retroactively added to the writing credits on all subsequent releases of the relevant songs. Love and Wilson reportedly had no malice toward each other in the lawsuit; unable to come to terms, they resorted to going to court to settle matters.)^{[citation needed]}

"Love was reportedly the initiator of a second successful lawsuit against Al Jardine (by the Beach Boys' company, Brother Records), for restriction of Jardine's use of the band name Beach Boys Family And Friends in his solo work.^{[citation needed]} --BwB (talk) 00:34, 8 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

BLP vios and vandalism, article semi-protected one week

Due to an IP editor repeatedly inserting BLP vios into the article plus assorted vandalism, I have requested that the article be semi-protected so that IP editors will be unable to edit the article for a week starting today. Jus da fax 19:29, 12 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Rollback of three edits by first-time editor

I have rolled back three edits to the article by first-time IP editor User:86.44.22.144. Just as an editor earlier this August tried to insert BLP violations, now these edits appear to be going in the other direction: to remove sourced material that may not reflect well on Mike Love. I have invited the new IP editor to discuss it here. Jus da fax 07:07, 28 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The section about the hall of fame entry etc. is lacking sources - that probably needs addressing ASAP. --Errant ^(chat!) 10:04, 28 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I'm sure there are multiple sources, as it is a well-known event. If no one else wants to, I'll look into that later today. Jus da fax 17:36, 28 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Recent changes in article: POV ?

I notice a series of back-and-forth changes going on with the article. Some appear to me to be trying to "spin" the article. I invite the editors involved to talk about the various points of view regarding the controversial parts of Love's career, and seek consensus. Thanks. Jus da fax 21:46, 3 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Some of the paragraphs that continue to be reintroduced to this article are problematic.

"Love has faced harsh criticism from a large contingent of Beach Boys fans, as well as from fellow musicians and music journalists."

"Large contingent"? How has this been accurately measured? He's definitely faced criticism from fans, that's very likely able to be sourced but the use of "harsh" and "large contingent" are examples of weasel words used to enforce the author's own opinion. Also, such a statement should probably be backed up with more solid examples of the musicians and music journalists involved in the criticizing.

"This perception is due to his strong and outspoken resistance to Brian Wilson's changing songwriting with the "Pet Sounds", and "SMiLE" projects"

This paragraph speaks in absolutes despite there being no direct, reliable source that states his resistance to the Pet Sounds project. The articles quoted are examples of Chinese whispers written 40 years after the fact and Love and others within the band have stated these claims are hyperbole, for this reason, it is our responsibility to use better sources to back up these facts or at least better alert readers of the questionable nature of them. Also, just a little food for thought for the spinsters: How could Love be resistant to Brian's changes in songwriting when he helped enable the transition to Pet Sounds with his writing contributions to "The Warmth of the Sun" and the heavy balladry on side two of The Beach Boys Today!? Love is quoted as saying in a late 1964 edition of Melody Maker that he didn't want the band to rest on their laurels to continue to chase the surfing fad. As for the Smile coverage, he has confirmed multiple times that he did have issues with some of the lyrics, so I think it's fair to report that he had a degree of reservation towards the project, however this is already mentioned on the Smile section of this article in addition to the Smile (The Beach Boys album) article in greater detail. How many times need it be addressed?

"The direction he took the Beach Boy's "post-SMiLE" music in,"

Even on some of the most critically derided Beach Boys output, such as M.I.U., Brian Wilson had a hand in composing 90% of the original tracks on the albums. Furthermore, Carl Wilson is arguably the most dominant force on albums such as Keepin' the Summer Alive and The Beach Boys (album). To solely place responsibility for these artistic endeavours on Mike is sloppy and incorrect.

"his numerous lawsuits against his bandmates"

Such as the one where he was denied credit for the songs he had a hand in penning and was denied royalties for 25 years? Something tells me he was kind of justified in these lawsuits and shouldn't be vilified and targeted for them. Should they be mentioned? Absolutely. Should they be spun to make him look a bad guy for it? No.

This is just a small segment of what's wrong with the edits the anonymous users are trying to inject into this article. I welcome them to debate their points here so we may achieve consensus on how to tackle this article, but at the moment, I'm going to revert the article to the version more agreeable with the BLP policy. Regards, Jamekae (talk) 04:49, 4 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks Jamekae. I appreciate your views. As this page shows, I have been concerned with the content of the article for years. I would now appreciate hearing from those who are for inclusion of the material you feel should be deleted. I am staying officially neutral at this time to facilitate the conversation, which I am glad you have begun with a frank and civil statement. Jus da fax 05:12, 4 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Mike Love/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Although I agree with the author, I feel as the this article's negative tone and opinion of the subject at hand, should be excluded.

Last edited at 17:01, 11 May 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 00:03, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

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License to tour as The Beach Boys

In the Career section it says he has a Lease (on the name). In the lede paras. it says was granted the rights... These two verbiages are not exactly conflicting, but they do present different views. “A Lease” suggests a payment was made. ??? Anyway, there seems to be some conflict around this on the article. Boscaswell talk 23:07, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Musicianship? Vocals?

This article should make reference to Mike Love's musical ability as it relates to his vocals. Not only did he provide lead vocals on many tracks, making him one of the main "lead vocalists in the group," but he also provided all the bass vocals. His bass vocal contributions are very unusual and unique in the context of pop music, and were important to the Beach Boys' sound. It is remarkable that he has the ability to sing a powerful conventional lead vocal, and also a very deep bass vocal. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.32.132.6 (talk) 20:57, 19 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

early life.

the phrase "a family resident in Los Angeles since the early 1920s" seems unclear and I suspect might be a typo. Not sure what the author meant to say. PurpleChez (talk) 17:34, 23 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]