Relative Clauses Data in Quechua
Relative Clauses Data in Quechua
Important issue:
The possessive markers also go with adverbial subordinate clauses:
Is this true? Is there nothing nominal in this construction? If this is so, then L&M (1988:
11) are right, and the subject marking in Q should be organized as those suffixes for
main tense (i.e. the possessives ni, etc.) and those for + main tense (i.e. the standard
subject agreement nii, etc.). What needs to be taken into account is that in Quechua this
kind of suffixes are also introducing a sentence in simultaneity with the main clause. If a
nominalization, this is a strange (very particular one).
Pidru hamu sqa n ta yacha ni. (L&M 1988:13)
Pedro come NMZ 3SG.POS ACC know 1SG
I know that Pedro came.
QUESTION: Doesn't this also means "I know the Pedro who came". Maybe Kay Pidruqa
hamusqanta yachani.
QUESTION: Can this also mean "I see that the woman is coming". For instance, in the
sentence like hampi (payman) quwanaypaq, warmi allinta mikhuqta uqa munani
"necesito que la mujer est comiendo bien para dar(le) la medicina" we need to use the
nominalization as a complement (the other possible meaning "I need the woman that eats
well" seems odd). Is this Q sentence possible.
QUESTION: Can I have: Manuilpa Pidruman libruta qusqanta yachani? Does the
sentence Manuilpa Pidruman libruta qusqanta riqsini means "I know the book that
Manuel gave to Pedro"?
Juan mi willa wa ra n ima ta Pidru q apa mu sqa n ta. (L&M 1988: 17)
Juan EV tell 1OBJ PAST 3SG what ACC Pedro GEN take CIS NMZ 3SG.POS ACC
Juan told me what Pedro had brought.
QUESTION
Is Juanmi imata Pidruq apamusqanta willawaran possible?
QUESTION
What is the difference between
What if mikhu q hamuni (I've come to eat) comes from mikhuypaq hamuni? I have to
ask Cerrn about this.
I believe that in this reading there's no ambiguity, the one walking is the object pay.
QUESTION: I think this forms are a little bit too generalized. I would need to see more
context, specially for the suwaq kani. What is the difference between suwaq kani and
suwa kani? Maybe it is the difference between "soy el que roba" y "soy ladrn" (if they
have any difference, of curse).
suwa sqa n runa (L&M 1988: 23)
the man that was robbed (by him)
suwa na n runa...
the man to be robbed (by him)
suwa q runa...
the man that robs
Qaynunchaw Pidru wiqchu ku sqa n rayku nana chi ku sha n. (L&M 1988: 23)
yesterday Pedro slip REFL NMZ 3SG.POS because pain CAUS REFL PROG 3SG
Because Pedro slipped yesterday he feels pain.
Chay papa kuna qa mana allin chu mikhu na paq. (L&M 1988: 23)
that potato PL TOP NEG good NEG eat NMZ DAT
Those potatoes are not good to eat.
QUESTION: Is it possible to find q forms as the subject of a clause (as in the case of
"free relatives"/ "Headless RCs" For instance, I have Urqupi yachaq runan llank'ashan
chakraypi (from Soto 146). What about Urqupi runa yachaq llank'ashan chakraypi (as an
IHRC)? Also, is it possible to have q as a complement of other than perception and
movement verbs? For instance, is this correct: uqa runa waka suwaqta maqarqani
("golpe al hombre que roba las vacas")?
L&M 1988: 24-) propose that Quechua has only three grm. categories: nominals, verbs,
and postpositions. Interestingly, the formal criteria to establish nominals is that they can
take the accusative marker ta: nouns, adjectives (which with ACC become adverbs),
queantifiers, numerals, WH-elements, pronouns, etc. That is an interesting suggestion.
What do I think? A formal criteria is always necessary to determine the behavior of an
element, but that doesn't explain anything about the reasons why those elements are
nominals. It could be very possible that adjectives don't use accusative to become
adverbials Does that make them less nominals? Are they, then, a class of their own? I
don't think that is a desirable conclusions (because it creates very specific classes, it goes
against generalization).
Allin ta rikun ni. (L&M 1988: 27)
a. I see well
b. I see the good one.
QUESTION: How do you say something like: Yo veo a bien a los estudiantes (Los
estudiantes estn bien y as lo veo), like uqa yachaqkunata allinta rikushani? The notion
of adverb is absent in Quechua as an independent category. To produce it the adjective is
considered a noun, but, following the idea in L&M (27) it is possible that there's an
empty noun present (or maybe not It depends on what I want to allow as "empty
categories", I would love to talk to Matt about it). The idea is that it should be something
akin to the Andean Spanish: ella come lo bien/lo bueno. This means that in this cases an
adjective is nominalized by marking it accusative (which is a very natural way to do this,
since Quechua has no article.). I need to ask Cerrn and check Escobar about this use in
Andean Spanish.
QUESTION: Is it OK to say platanu mikhusqaykita yachani? I will assume that the scope
of the case marker in the nominalized verb reaches the whole clause.
pi man Juan sara ta qu sqa n ta yacha nki chu? (L&M 1988: 31)
who ILL Juan corn ACC give NMZ 3SG.POS ACC know 2SG INT
Do you know to whom Juan gave the corn?
QUESTION: Can I say Juanpa Pidruman sarata qusqanta yachani? What is the
difference with the senence above? What about Juanpa Pidruman sara qusqanta
yachani?
Juan pa pi man sara qu sqa n ta yacha nki chu. (L&M 1988: 32)
Juan GEN who ILL corn give NMZ 3SG.POS ACC know 2SG INT
(Do you know) to whom Juan gave the corn?
QUESTION: What is the semantic difference between these two sentences. I might ask
Marita using another kind of contrast in Spanish. What is the difference between the "half
full glass" and the "half empty glass". L&M (32) suggest that the difference is that this
form, with GEN and no ACC inside the IHRC is "more nominal" (heads an NP), while
the other version heads a VP. Maybe it is just because the lack of marking in sara is
compensated with the marking of Juan in the genitive.
Is it possible to have the following?
In chapter 6 L&M will deal with the interesting fact that the morphology related to
subject "RCs" is very different from other "object RCs". In fact, their point is very
interesting and I must take a close look: the class of object relations is very wide in
Quechua, it is not clean cut as in Spanish, where object means "direct object". There's in
Quechua an asymmetry of subject/non-subject that governs person marking. For L&M
this is related basically to what falls in the domain of VP (different objects and adjuncts, I
believe), and what falls into the domain of AGR (S level, which would be the subject, I
think).
maqa y ta muna wa n.
hit INF ACC want 1OBJ 3SG
He wants to hit me.
QUESTION: Is there a difference when the object is inside the matrix and when it is in
the infinitive? Quiero verla / la quiero ver. Maybe this is one of those cases in which
there are two ways to present information, and since there's no possible semantic
distinction associated between those two, they keep working. However: quiero primero
verla y luego / * la quiero primero ver y luego This means that quiero ver should be
considered a unit for the clitic to be used, while quiero ver is querer + ver where the
infinitive has certain independence. The problem is that I can't find any semantic
importance to this distinction.
QUESTION: What is the kind of intonation pattern that hamunqa chayta yachani
follows. My impression is that is a juxtaposition, and there's a pause between hamunqa
and chayta.
QUESTION: L&M state that inflectional NMZ can have a DO, while derivational NMZ
can't. So, are these possible?
The main question is: when is it fine for a NMZ with q to use nominal agreement
(possessive suffixes)? I don't recall having those examples, and that might be related to
what Calvo said: generative linguists tend to put q in a different category.
T'anta [qu wa sqa yki] mana allin hina chu ka sqa (74)
bread give 1OBJ NMZ 2SG.POS NEG good like NEG be PLUQ
The bread you gave me turned out not so good.
llamk'a q ku (74)
work AG PL
They used to work
QUESTION: This form is particularly odd! I haven't run into this meaning for the AG
before. Is Chay runakuna llamk'aqku (Those men used to work) possible? This is the
habitual past use of q (which uses the verb kay in ever person, except the third one). I
need to research more about it.
The use of a possessive marker in a nominalized NP with q points not to the subject, but
to the object. However, when the suffix is sqa, then the subject seems to be pointed out.
In fact, there's a passive construction, and with sqa the object has been promoted to
subject, so NOMZ with q and sqa still pick the (logical) object. If this is true, there's a
problem with for instance, Spanish "mi salida", where mi points to the doer of the salida
and no passive form is conceivable. Maybe the use of participle forms is restricted to
those verbs that have an unacussative (dynamic intransitives) meaning.
QUESTION:
How do you say in Quechua: T, que comes mucha carne, debes ver al medico: "qan,
ancha aychata mikhuq, hampiqman rikunan kashan"? What about "ancha aychata
mikhuniykiq hampiqman rikunan kashan"? (the last one should be bad, meaning
something like "The one that ate a lot of meat from me must see the doctor").
QUESTION: L&M say that the comparision between ta and lla makes the first almost
a derivational marker. In fact, they say that not only ta, but man, -wan, and manta
participate in these kind of combinations. The important exception for this argumentation
is qpa (genitive). They argue (successfully) that the genitive is a clitic, and not a suffix
in Quechua. to me, it is interesting that these kind of uses for case suffixes is available in
Quechua, since this could be an explanation to those weird uses of ta in positions that
are not expected.
QUESTION: How can I say "I know him, who built a house" Payta wasita ruwasqanta
yachani? This doesn't sound right to me, because riqsini would be used. Then, which one
is possible:
QUESTION: Does this also mean: "you have done the god one"?
QUESTION: According to L&M 118, the combination q (GEN) and -ta (ACC) is
ungrammatical inside of a nominalized clause. This means that
The following combinations are possible (but it always depends on the kind of
nominalization used) (121):
SUBJECT OBJ
-q 0
0 -ta
0 0
1. Uses of sqa
a. Relative clause
Juan cha q runa riku sqa n wasi ta rura n. (118)
Juan DIM GEN person see NMZ 3SG.POS house ACC do 3SG
The man that Juan saw builds a house.
QUESTION
Is it possible to say: Runa qulqi qusqan warmiman chayta nirqani? What about a clearer
IHRC form like Runa warmiman qulqita qusqanta nirqani?
b. Complement clause
-q / 0
kay warmi q qusa n maqa sqa n ta yacha ra nki chu? (119)
this woman GEN husband 3SG.POS hit NMZ 3SG.POS ACC know PAST 2SG INT
Did you know that this woman hit her husband?
0/0
kay warmi qusa n maqa sqa n ta yacha ra nki chu? (119)
this woman GEN husband 3SG.POS hit NMZ 3SG.POS ACC know PAST 2SG INT
Did you know that this woman hit her husband?
0 / -ta
Kay warmi qusa n ta maqa sqa n ta yacha ra nki chu.
this woman husband 3SG.POS ACC hit NMZ 3SG.POS ACC know PAST 2SG INT
Did you know that this woman hit her husband?
2. Uses of na
a. Relative clauses
GEN / 0
Qan pa runa riku na yki man rima sha ni. (119)
you GEN person see NMZ 2SG.POS ILL speak PROG 1SG
I speak to the man that you will see.
b. Complement clauses:
GEN / 0
Mariya q platanu ranti mu na ta yacha ni. (119)
Maria GEN banana buy CIS NMZ ACC know 1SG
I know that Maria will buy bananas.
0/-ta
Mariya platanu -ta ranti mu na ta yacha ni. (119)
Maria GEN banana buy CIS NMZ ACC know 1SG
I know that Maria will buy bananas.
c. Obligational clauses
GEN / 0
Qan pa ima pas ruwa na yki ka sha n. (119)
you GEN what ADD do NMZ 2SG.POS be PROG 3SG
you have to do something
- / -ta
ruwa sha na yki ima lla ta pas. (119)
do PROG NMZ 2SG.POS what LIM ACC ADD
You have to do something.
QUESTION: Is it possible to say Qan imatapas ruwanayki kashan (I think it is)? What
about Qan ruwashanayki imallatapas?
L&M say that 0/-ta in compl. clauses is marginal (as it was the case for sqa), while the
presence of ta in obligative constructions is also marginal (although that is not what
Aroz & Salas have in their examples, nor something I had learned). Finally, very
important, -ta is impossible in relative clauses with na. So, I have to ask if something
like
Mariyaq runata rikunanta riqsini
Qan pa runa ta riku na yki man rima sha ni
Qan runa -ta riku na yki man rima sha ni.
3. Uses of q
c. Perception clause
Juan cha ta [e ima pas ni q ta] riku ni. (121)
Juan DIM ACC what ADD say AG ACC see 1SG
I see juan say something
Juan cha tai [ei ima ta pas ni q ta] riku ni. (121)
Juan DIM ACC what ACC ADD say AG ACC see 1SG
I see Juan say something
QUESTION: The difference between those two previous sentences is not very clear in
L&M. They say that the second one has a verb with raised subject. I have copied the
notation for empty categories they use. As far as I can understand, the very notion of
"raising" as happening in the second sentence involves that Juancha was a subject to
imatapas niq, where it was marked 0 (NOM). We know that a q nominalization can
have a subject present in the IHRC/EHRC. This means that the extraction makes Juancha
the DO of rikuni. But this doesn't say anything about the previous sentence, in which
Juanchata was also ACC, but it was not considered to have been extracted from the
nominalized clause. My only guess for the structure of that sentence, with no extraction
but ACC marking, is that it should be considered an apposition of the kind: "I see
[JuanDO], [the one that says something]DO. The lack of ACC in imapas (which is normally
expressed imatapas, 'something') has to be explained as the common absence of ACC in a
"free relative" with q. (Although, L&M say that ta objects are possible, but marginal).
Still this means that there's a systematic absence of ta in q clauses unless extraction,
which means that the following must be possible and most common: Juancha imapas
niqta rikuni, which is NOT like Juanchata imapas niqta rikuni, while Juancha imatapas
niqta rikuni should be possible, but marginal.
Also, perception clauses, comp. movement verb, and past habitual q clauses always
have an empty subject.
QUESTION: L&M assume that the q clause has an e subject, but they don't say
anything about how it gets interpreted. It seems that the q clause is a complement that
can't take an object with ta. How can this be? This implies reviewing the literature about
"reduced clauses", and, of course, control and raising (since the question is: does the q
clause has a logical subject that is the same as that of the matrix? If not then I should look
for the answer in a comparison between the goal expressed with q and all the other
possible goals in quechua).
Is it possible to have Pedro papata rantiq rishan. Aroz & Salas don't have ACC for this
goal with q constructions. If this is tru, then WHY???
QUESTION: Again, L&M assume that the q clause has no subject. In other words, they
are presented as nominalized forms, but their syntax, as those authors stated (121) "is
different". The subject in the previous sentence is clear fro the matrix (-ni), however, in
the q clause we have that no subject is present, and maybe not even possible (that's why
L&M said that in this kind of sentences the subject position is ALWAYS empty). Again,
this is a very interesting kind of complement and, as such, it should be considered (not
the kind of complement of verba dicendi, verba cogitandi or a relative clause.
QUESTION: The notion of "restructured verb" is not clear at all to me. Maybe it is a left
dislocation? Or maybe this suggests that the clause papata mikhun became papata
mikhuq, so the ta was already there whent the restructuration took place. Not clear! I
don't think L&M are using restructuring in the sense of Rizzi's "restructuring verbs" (voy
a verlo / lo voy a ver).