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The Labour Party's Minister for Women

The Chippendales Telefun Club

Labour's would-be Minister for Women, Janet Anderson, talks to Petronella Wyatt about strip shows, equal opportunities and her ideal man

IF TONY BLAIR wins the next election, Janet Anderson, the Labour MP for Rossendale and Darwen, will be left holding one of the least enviable portfolios in Westminster. Since being promoted in the recent shadow cabinet reshuffle, she is primed to become the country's first ever Minister for Women.

The very idea is a paradox. If women are the same as men - which appears to be the modern consensus - why do they need special treatment? If, on the other hand, they are not, is a women's ministry a patronising admission of inferiority?

So far, the sisterhood has failed to show Anderson much support. In fact, one of her former female employees is in the process of taking her to court for unfair dismissal.

I do not know what to expect when I walk into Anderson's office in Whitehall. One vaguely imagines a future Minister for Women to have contours like a battleship and eyes with the steeliness of a hitman. The woman who greets me, however, is a perfected physical presence; her hair is blonde and sleek and her lips are painted a slippery red. Beside her desk is a basin covered in expensive-looking scent bottles. There is champagne on a sideboard. It is the sort of room that ought to belong to Teresa Gorman.

Anderson is vastly amused when I say so. "Oh," she says, "how funny. You've noticed the champagne. Please don't say shadow Minister for Women pissed! Actually, it's Steve's." Steve? She gestures to her male assistant, with whom she shares the office. Steve, who cannot be more than 25, is looking nervous.

'Women will become more promiscuous under a Labour government'

For most of her career, Anderson has escaped the attentions of the media. Her father was a Labour Party agent in Newcastle upon Tyne, and her first job was as Barbara Castle's secretary. It was Castle, of course, who introduced the Equal Pay Act. Before becoming an MP in the 1992 intake, Anderson was also secretary to Jack Straw, the shadow home secretary, and an assistant to Gordon Brown - two powerful allies for an ambitious Labour politician.

Does she believe there is any difference between men and women? "Of course there is. A man will talk about himself, but a woman will talk about other people."

Is that all? "Yes. Though they have different priorities, I think men and women care about the same things in the same way." Does she include sex in that? She does. Anderson believes that changing social conditions have completely altered the female view of sex. "Women are just as open about sex now as men. You can tell that by reading women's magazines, in which they talk about men's bums and how good they are at it. Men and women now behave similarly."

But aren't men, biologically, more promiscuous? "I don't think so. Anyway, it's all about social conditioning, not biology. Things will change even more." Does she mean that women will become more promiscuous? Her answer seems completely serious. "Yes. Under Labour, women will become more promiscuous. That's an election pledge." Do you mean that? "Yes."

Who would go and see a man take off his clothes, apart from a few delayed adolescents and a psychopathic old maid or two? Who wouldn't?

This is the most interesting election pledge I have heard - it certainly beats raising or lowering taxes. I notice that Steve has uttered what Victorian novelists used to call a hollow groan. Anderson continues in her earnest way. "Women like seeing men as sex objects," she says. Nonsense, I say. How many women buy pictures of naked men? Has she, for instance? "No, but I don't see why we shouldn't."

But who would go and see a man take off his clothes, apart from a few delayed adolescents and a psychopathic old maid or two? It seems that Anderson would. "I would be tempted to see a male strip show. If women are sex objects, men must be, too. Male bodies are just as aesthetically pleasing as women's." (Steve now has his head in his hands.)

Is her brief, then, to encourage women to populate the nation's strip clubs? She giggles. What is her brief? "I will assure families of their financial security." Isn't that the chancellor's job? What parts will Anderson reach that other ministers cannot?

"Well, I am already attracting the women's vote. The women's vote will decide the election. Women have tended to vote Tory in the past. This is because they thought Labour was dominated by cloth-cap unionists with chauvinistic views. New Labour is more women-friendly."

One of her tasks, she says, will be to establish more women in senior working positions

Anderson is an impassioned supporter of female-only shortlists, an issue that has caused Blair some embarrassment. Indeed, the Labour leader was said to be personally opposed to the idea, and an industrial tribunal finally ruled such lists illegal.

But Anderson is undeterred. "I know all that, but we will try and get around the ruling." Does she never worry about alienating those "cloth-cap chauvinists" who are still an essential part of the Labour vote? "Well, they have sisters and wives who will support us."

One of her tasks, she says, will be to establish more women in senior working positions. How will this be achieved? "Employers will be persuaded not to discriminate." This sounds to me like coercion. "Half the electorate are women; they should have half the jobs." Do they deserve them? What of criticisms that some Labour frontbenchers owe their positions less to genius than to their sex? "It would never enter my head to believe that."

But let us say that Anderson is running a company. Two people of equal merit apply for the same job; one of them is male and the other female. Which would she hire? "The woman." Isn't that impolitic? In some areas of high unemployment, there is an angry feeling that women are stealing men's jobs. "They are not stealing them. Women working doesn't create higher male unemployment." (Actually, every post-war statistic has indicated the contrary.)

She will concede, though, that for poorer families, it is often important for the man to work

A telephone rings. Steve answers it, only to be admonished by his boss: "Don't answer the phone, it's so irritating. Put it on the answer machine." Anderson returns to the matter of jobs for the girls. "Anyway, it's all a natural process. All the jobs becoming available are for women."

This would seem a contradiction of everything Anderson has said before. If it is true, I argue, her job is irrelevant.

She fails to see my point. She will concede, though, that for poorer families, it is often important for the man to work, particularly if there are children. Anderson herself used to employ what she calls a "child-minder" for her children: James, 18, David, 16, and 14-year-old Katie by her lawyer husband, Vince Humphreys. But she could afford one. "I do see that that is a problem. I also see it is good for children to have a female influence around. Women are so much more caring."

Her view of women's moral worth is starry-eyed. In some ways, it is similar to the Victorian belief, as Bertrand Russell put it, in "the superior virtue of the oppressed". The Victorians credited women with higher ideals than men's, but this belief in women's spiritual superiority was part and parcel of the determination to keep them down economically and politically.

Now that men have been worsted in that battle, is it not fair that they be allowed to give up offering "reverence" as a consolation for inferiority?

Does she think women ever provoke men? She bangs her hand on the table in blank fury. "Women never 'ask for it'!

This is a pertinent question, as Anderson is fighting for a Draconian anti-stalking law, described by one opponent as so wide that it would prevent journalists legitimately going about their business. Come on, I prompt, if a woman has the right to take care of her own future, shouldn't she be expected to take care of herself as well? "No."

Does she think women ever provoke men? She bangs her hand on the table in blank fury. "Women never 'ask for it'! They should be allowed to wear a mini-skirt and whatever they like without being approached by a man." Isn't this unrealistic? "No."

Her old-fashioned Northern upbringing may have something to do with her views. "Where we lived, the men weren't allowed in the kitchen and the women weren't allowed in the pub." Has her life been a rebellion against that? "I suppose it has coloured things. I did want to marry a man who would be prepared to do housework."

She married Humphreys in 1972. Is he a New Man? "Vince is very supportive and a good friend. He helps." This does not sound like a testimony to undying passion. "Marriage is a contract. Oh, dear. That is not very sexy, is it?"

What is her beau idéal? "A New Man, but strong." Does Blair correspond to that? "Tony is definitely a New Man and he is very strong. He gets on very well with women. He really likes us."

Suddenly, Anderson is all girlishness. Does she find him attractive? She plays with her hair like an ingenue. "Oh, yes. Absolutely. He is very attractive. Yes, the ideal."

From the corner of my eye, I can see Steve; he looks as if he is quietly haemorrhaging.

26 September 1996: Stalkers will be outlawed by next May, says Howard

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