Talk:Barack Obama

Template:Community article probation

Heritage

I imagine this has been discussed innumerable times before but isn't "African-American" a bit vague and misleading a term to describe BO's ethnic background? Considering he is half white and half Kenyan, shouldn't the proper term to use be "mulatto"? -Red marquis (talk) 03:28, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

See Talk:Barack_Obama/FAQ. Q2. We're done here. OrangeMarlin ^{Talk• Contributions} 03:54, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

This question has been asked over and over again, and is included in the FAQ, so I won't waste much time here. I just wanted to point out that "mulatto" is NEVER the proper term. It's like asking if the proper term should be "colored" or "negro." And, in case you didn't know, the answer on both of those would be a resounding NO as well.Jdlund (talk) 17:38, 24 June 2011 (UTC)

My cousin has an African-American Dad and an Caucasian Mom and he is classified as Bi-Racial so what makes the President so different? — Preceding unsigned comment added by CEfirestone (talk • contribs) 08:39, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

I read your FAQ and its wrong,you cant take everything the media tells you serious.He is Bi-racial PERIOD. Preceding unsigned comment added by CEfirestone (talk • contribs)08:46, 17 July 2011

When you say [something-something] "PERIOD", do you mean that an explanation or discussion is not warranted? If so, please go away, because nobody will take your dictates seriously. If on the other hand you haven't merely read the FAQ item but have also digested it, and if you can here argue cogently against it and say why "bi-racial" is the better term, then go ahead. Please provide clear evidence, but also be concise. At the end of your comment, hit "~" four times in a row to "sign" it. -- Hoary (talk) 09:20, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

Is there any consensus that he's "African American?" Literally, he's clearly multi-racial, since is mother was white. He wasn't born or raised in africa, and wasn't raised in a household influenced significantly be african culture (i.e., his african father left the household when he was a small child). People I know from africa laugh at the American label "african-american" - since people on the african continent do not consider the african continent as defining a culture or people. I'm not taking a poll/vote, but curious if there's any reasoned consensus on this subject. John2510 (talk) 04:04, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

What people from Africa feel is largely irrelevant. "African-American" is more an Ameri-centric (obviously) sociological construct rather than a specific/literal ethnic identifier; here, it simply means black, or as my politically incorrect gramma would say, colored. Obama self-identifies as African-American, and the vast majority of reliable sources use the term as well. That is what we go with.

On the contrary, the vast majority of reliable sources understand that he is biracial (or multi-racial), as is clearly accurate, e.g.:

http://articles.cnn.com/2008-06-09/politics/btsc.obama.race_1_black-candidate-black-father-barack-obama?_s=PM:POLITICS

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1584736,00.html

http://thedailyvoice.com/voice/2008/12/is-obama-really-black-001459.php

Are there any sources that clearly discuss the issue and consider him to be african american versus multi-racial? If he self-identifies as being of a single race, that would certainly be an appropriate label for the context, in contrast to his actual racial background. 04:48, 5 August 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by John2510 (talk • contribs)

Never mind. My correction and a single revision lead to my being banned from this article by NuclearWarfare: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:John2510&diff=443125824&oldid=443124961

People will have to figure this out without me. Fortunately, this is an issue where the truth is widely known, but it's a pretty scary statement about POV censorship on WP. 05:05, 5 August 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by John2510 (talk • contribs)

See, WP:TRUTH and WP:V. You did not provide sources, and first off, never attempted to engage in debate on the talk page. This article is under ArbCom probation, and you violated it. Simple as that. Its not censorship at all. Phearson (talk) 05:28, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

This is basically a test... since I've been told I'm banned from editing on this discussion page as well: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:John2510&diff=443134158&oldid=443125824, which prevents my ability to even discuss the subject.

Sources are above (does anyone have any good faith question about his biracial status... really???).

You can say it's not censorship... just as you can say President Obama isn't biracial. Wow.... John2510 (talk) 05:47, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

Approval/Disapproval

Shouldn't there be a section about public approval? We have one for George Bush, why not our current president? The current Gallop Poll shows him at 42% approve 50% disapprove. http://www.gallup.com/home.aspx --68.37.181.39 (talk) 15:47, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

This is already adequately covered in United States presidential approval rating and Presidency of Barack Obama. -- Scjessey (talk) 18:50, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

It would be odd to have that in the bio until it actually has some significance. For instance, if he were to lose the election next year, mention of low approval ratings leading up to the election might make sense. But now, when we are talking about a fluid process with the numbers going up and down with no real impact, it just seems rather arbitrary. It would also seem somewhat arbitrary to pick Gallup over any other poll out there, but that's besides the point. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jdlund (talk • contribs) 20:09, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

Fix the image format

Not sure why it is doing it but can someone please re-format the image of Operation Neptune Spear so it isn't in the 2012 re-election section and is sitting in the Bin Laden section where it belongs. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bofum (talk • contribs) 07:17, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

Seems to be a crowded enough section as is. If that image were moved up it would end up leaving us with barely any text in between the images. Crisco 1492 (talk) 02:39, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

Should the alma mater in the infobox say "Harvard Law School" or "Harvard University"?

I would like to think that the infobox would detail the general university, and upon further reading of the article, the specific college of that university would be stated. If a person studied business at Cornell University, should their alma mater in their infobox be "Cornell University" or "Samuel Curtis Johnson Graduate School of Management"? I'd like to know other peoples' thoughts on this. :) Grenadetoenails (talk) 07:56, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

Presidency

Obama will be the 44th president, but the 43rd man to hold the office. It all goes back to Grover Cleveland who was first elected president in 1884 but was defeated for re-election in 1888. Four years later, he ran for president again and won. He is the only president with two divided terms. After much debate, historians now recognize him as both the 22th and 24th President of the United States — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.16.2.116 (talk) 04:34, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

And the question of the day is: What does this have to do with improving the article? Looks more like an inviting argument that needs to be taken to scholars, not wikipedia. See WP:NOTFORUM Phearson (talk) 15:40, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Link FA

Can someone explain why the Link FA template isn't at the top of the page? —WP:PENGUIN · ^{[ TALK ]} 00:56, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

What is "Link FA"? Phearson (talk) 16:57, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

If the question is what happened to the FA star, it seems to have disappeared because too many templates are in use on this page and one more was added which knocked this one out. I moved up the FA template, which reinstated the star, but the overall issue should be addressed. I see that the Link FA template is there for about 6 other languages, but I am not an expert in the use of these templates, nor did I find the documentation particularly illuminating, So I can't answer that - but the FA star is back, and I think it's important that it remain visible. Tvoz/talk 21:26, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

That was my question and glad it's fixed. —WP:PENGUIN · ^{[ TALK ]} 02:27, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

no controversy in the lead?

WP:LEAD: It should define the topic, establish context, explain why the subject is interesting or notable, and summarize the most important points—including any prominent controversies. [emphasis added]

is there support for adding text to the lead about the most notable controversies concerning president Obama? Darkstar1st (talk) 12:14, 31 July 2011 (UTC)

Are there any notable controversies in the article that are missing from the lead? The lead is very dense, so most topics are only mentioned, not discussed. Repeal of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" , e.g., was controversial and is mentioned. Similarly with the health care reform bill. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 12:34, 31 July 2011 (UTC)

I agree that the lead is quite dense and I don't think anything significant is missing. Tvoz/talk 04:17, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

a state of prolonged public dispute or debate, usually concerning a matter of opinion. maybe this debt ceiling debate would qualify? Darkstar1st (talk) 09:43, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Small typing error

"His concession speech after the New Hampshire primary was set to music by independent artists as the music video "Yes We Can", which was viewed by 10 million people on YouTube in its first month and received a Daytime Emmy Award. In December 2008, Time magazine named Barack Obama as its Person of the Year for his historic candidacy and election, which it described as "the steady march of seemingly impossible accomplishments". should read "His concession speech after the New Hampshire primary was set to music by independent artists as was the music video "Yes We Can", which was viewed by 10 million people on YouTube in its first month and received a Daytime Emmy Award. In December 2008, Time magazine named Barack Obama as its Person of the Year for his historic candidacy and election, which it described as "the steady march of seemingly impossible accomplishments". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.97.138.24 (talk) 17:39, 31 July 2011 (UTC)

 Not done: Thanks for the input, but actually that is not correct - the original wording is right: the music video "Yes We Can" was that speech was set to music, not a separate entity which "as was the music video" would mean. Tvoz/talk 04:23, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

Obama Approval Drops to New Low of 40%

See: http://www.gallup.com/poll/148739/Obama-Approval-Drops-New-Low.aspx. This should be added to the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.97.40.195 (talk) 12:11, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Yes! This stunning drop from 41% to 40% must be given maximal coverage. A minimum of 4 or 5 paragraphs would be the only way to do this precipitous loss of support justice. -- Scjessey (talk) 14:12, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Actually, it's 43% today. -- Scjessey (talk) 14:17, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Facepalm For those of you who may stumble upon this and unable to see the sarcasm. The answer is no. Phearson (talk) 17:43, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Youtube controversy, Yes We Can

From the main article: "the music video "Yes We Can", which was viewed by 10 million people on YouTube in its first month[257] and received a Daytime Emmy Award."

The problem is that the reference does not says it in this form: "The first, in which celebrities sing along to an Obama speech, has received over 10 million hits", and this does not mean that there are 10 million (different) people who watched this video. Because the same person can watch it multiple times and hence youtube count him/her multiple times. Furthermore in the Yes_We_Can article uses (I think) the correct term: "...the video had been watched a combined total of more than 22-million times among all of the postings." Moreover see the youtube's official support page http://www.google.com/support/youtube/bin/answer.py?hl=en-GB&answer=154414 : "What is a view? A view occurs when a person watches your video."

Consequently my suggestion is that to replace the text by : "...which viewed 10 million times..." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.97.42.240 (talk) 20:24, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

I don't see the controversy, but you make a great point that we should be more precise about describing Youtube hits versus total views (whether on Youtube or other sites). Best, - Wikidemon (talk) 22:28, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

Thanks, in this case could you update the article? (I can not edit it.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.131.148.222 (talk) 23:53, 4 August 2011 (UTC)